Trump talking pardons and Hillary

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Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by ip_law-hokie »

Not looking good my neck friends.

Donald Trump claims 'complete power' to issue pardons amid reports he wants to pardon himself over Russia investigations - Evening Standard
https://apple.news/AZ4ejjioaTV-ENZ8_fp8BiQ



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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by nolanvt »

If it comes to that, he would have the authority to pardon himself. Nothing in the Constitution prevents it.


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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

Do we need to add IP to truther nutjob list?

I'm more of the opinion every day the Mueller's only purpose is to try and bait Trump into firing him.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by BigDave »

nolanvt wrote:If it comes to that, he would have the authority to pardon himself. Nothing in the Constitution prevents it.


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That's questionable. Most legal scholars that I have read believe that a pardon requires a pardoner and a penitent and that they must be two different people. Obviously, it would come down to what the Supreme Court does and maybe a Republican Supreme Court sides with the (nominally) Republican President?

Here is what the constitution actually says:

"... and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment."

I'm kinda curious if there is a case anywhere where a governor has pardoned himself. (Example: there was a case in Kentucky in 2003 where the governor issued a blanked pardon to anyone who may have been involved in a particular political scandal, but he excluded himself from that pardon.)
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by nolanvt »

BigDave wrote:
nolanvt wrote:If it comes to that, he would have the authority to pardon himself. Nothing in the Constitution prevents it.


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That's questionable. Most legal scholars that I have read believe that a pardon requires a pardoner and a penitent and that they must be two different people. Obviously, it would come down to what the Supreme Court does and maybe a Republican Supreme Court sides with the (nominally) Republican President?

Here is what the constitution actually says:

"... and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment."

I'm kinda curious if there is a case anywhere where a governor has pardoned himself. (Example: there was a case in Kentucky in 2003 where the governor issued a blanked pardon to anyone who may have been involved in a particular political scandal, but he excluded himself from that pardon.)
If that's all the text that covers pardons in the Constitution, nothing I read from that restricts Presidents from pardoning themselves pre-impeachment (wouldn't be in the cards for Trump until 2019 at the earliest), but the optics would be terrible. Nixon is the only other President in modern times who would have possibly considered it, but he was going to resign and had assurances Ford was going to pardon him.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

BigDave wrote:
nolanvt wrote:If it comes to that, he would have the authority to pardon himself. Nothing in the Constitution prevents it.


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That's questionable. Most legal scholars that I have read believe that a pardon requires a pardoner and a penitent and that they must be two different people. Obviously, it would come down to what the Supreme Court does and maybe a Republican Supreme Court sides with the (nominally) Republican President?

Here is what the constitution actually says:

"... and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment."

I'm kinda curious if there is a case anywhere where a governor has pardoned himself. (Example: there was a case in Kentucky in 2003 where the governor issued a blanked pardon to anyone who may have been involved in a particular political scandal, but he excluded himself from that pardon.)
Who argued that? I've never heard or read of anyone worth a damn say the President couldn't pardon himself. The president's power is plenary.

Talking about governors is apples: oranges. Their authority comes from the respective state constitutions.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by ip_law-hokie »

nolanvt wrote:If it comes to that, he would have the authority to pardon himself. Nothing in the Constitution prevents it.


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Maybe it's good thing that we have Trump to drain your the swamp and help settle this open constitutional issue.


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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by nolanvt »

ip_law-hokie wrote:
nolanvt wrote:If it comes to that, he would have the authority to pardon himself. Nothing in the Constitution prevents it.


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Maybe it's good thing that we have Trump to drain your the swamp and help settle this open constitutional issue.


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Ha! +1

A Constitutional Amendment to ensure Presidents can't pardon themselves wouldn't be a bad idea.


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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by ip_law-hokie »

LOL. Kushner has had to amend his security clearance form 39 times.

Good job with the swamp.

Kushner Confirms Four Russia Meetings, Calls Them Insignificant - Bloomberg
https://apple.news/AC8i8BdvZQ8GwpHecEdIHFQ


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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

ip_law-hokie wrote:LOL. Kushner has had to amend his security clearance form 39 times.

Good job with the swamp.

Kushner Confirms Four Russia Meetings, Calls Them Insignificant - Bloomberg
https://apple.news/AC8i8BdvZQ8GwpHecEdIHFQ


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And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by ip_law-hokie »

USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:LOL. Kushner has had to amend his security clearance form 39 times.

Good job with the swamp.

Kushner Confirms Four Russia Meetings, Calls Them Insignificant - Bloomberg
https://apple.news/AC8i8BdvZQ8GwpHecEdIHFQ


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And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
Got it.


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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

ip_law-hokie wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:LOL. Kushner has had to amend his security clearance form 39 times.

Good job with the swamp.

Kushner Confirms Four Russia Meetings, Calls Them Insignificant - Bloomberg
https://apple.news/AC8i8BdvZQ8GwpHecEdIHFQ


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And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
Got it.


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You have a pattern of questionable behavior which would undoubtedly be uncovered on an SSBI, let alone a poly. Just sayin. Kushner has had a microscope up his arse for the last 6 months and still has a clearance last I checked.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by ip_law-hokie »

USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:LOL. Kushner has had to amend his security clearance form 39 times.

Good job with the swamp.

Kushner Confirms Four Russia Meetings, Calls Them Insignificant - Bloomberg
https://apple.news/AC8i8BdvZQ8GwpHecEdIHFQ


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And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
Got it.


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You have a pattern of questionable behavior which would undoubtedly be uncovered on an SSBI, let alone a poly. Just sayin. Kushner has had a microscope up his arse for the last 6 months and still has a clearance last I checked.
Good thing I'm not a government contractor making a living off the dole.


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With their Cap’n and Chief Intelligence Officer having deserted them, River, Ham and Joe valiantly continue their whataboutismistic last stand of the DJT apology tour.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

ip_law-hokie wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:LOL. Kushner has had to amend his security clearance form 39 times.

Good job with the swamp.

Kushner Confirms Four Russia Meetings, Calls Them Insignificant - Bloomberg
https://apple.news/AC8i8BdvZQ8GwpHecEdIHFQ


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And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
Got it.


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You have a pattern of questionable behavior which would undoubtedly be uncovered on an SSBI, let alone a poly. Just sayin. Kushner has had a microscope up his arse for the last 6 months and still has a clearance last I checked.
Good thing I'm not a government contractor making a living off the dole.

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Lawyer is certainly a good career path for immoral folks. :mrgreen:

BTW, you butchered the ever living crap out of that phrase.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by ip_law-hokie »

USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
ip_law-hokie wrote:LOL. Kushner has had to amend his security clearance form 39 times.

Good job with the swamp.

Kushner Confirms Four Russia Meetings, Calls Them Insignificant - Bloomberg
https://apple.news/AC8i8BdvZQ8GwpHecEdIHFQ


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
Got it.


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You have a pattern of questionable behavior which would undoubtedly be uncovered on an SSBI, let alone a poly. Just sayin. Kushner has had a microscope up his arse for the last 6 months and still has a clearance last I checked.
Good thing I'm not a government contractor making a living off the dole.

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Lawyer is certainly a good career path for immoral folks. :mrgreen:

BTW, you butchered the ever living crap out of that phrase.
Got it.


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With their Cap’n and Chief Intelligence Officer having deserted them, River, Ham and Joe valiantly continue their whataboutismistic last stand of the DJT apology tour.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by BigDave »

USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Obama had a staffer who was denied a clearance and forced to withdraw. Not really sure how you could argue that given the Flynn mess.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by awesome guy »

USN_Hokie wrote:
BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Obama had a staffer who was denied a clearance and forced to withdraw. Not really sure how you could argue that given the Flynn mess.
Obama wouldn't have gotten a clearance without being an elected official.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

awesome guy wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Obama had a staffer who was denied a clearance and forced to withdraw. Not really sure how you could argue that given the Flynn mess.
Obama wouldn't have gotten a clearance without being an elected official.
Fair enough. That I would agree with.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by HokieFanDC »

BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Clearly, with Kushner, his position has allowed him to retain his clearance. How many "oops" do you get with regard to your disclosures, before it's clear you can't be trusted?
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

HokieFanDC wrote:
BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Clearly, with Kushner, his position has allowed him to retain his clearance. How many "oops" do you get with regard to your disclosures, before it's clear you can't be trusted?
Clearly? Please explain your rationale and bonafides.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by HokieFanDC »

USN_Hokie wrote:
HokieFanDC wrote:
BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Clearly, with Kushner, his position has allowed him to retain his clearance. How many "oops" do you get with regard to your disclosures, before it's clear you can't be trusted?
Clearly? Please explain your rationale and bonafides.
LOL. Lying on the clearance form should be reason enough not to get clearance. He submitted a BS form to start with. Then after months of revising it, he still "left out" meetings. How many chances do you think he should get?
Maybe he should take a polygraph as a test of his trustworthiness. That would be a good start, because the initial results of his clearance process are pretty lousy.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by USN_Hokie »

HokieFanDC wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
HokieFanDC wrote:
BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Clearly, with Kushner, his position has allowed him to retain his clearance. How many "oops" do you get with regard to your disclosures, before it's clear you can't be trusted?
Clearly? Please explain your rationale and bonafides.
LOL. Lying on the clearance form should be reason enough not to get clearance. He submitted a BS form to start with. Then after months of revising it, he still "left out" meetings. How many chances do you think he should get?
Maybe he should take a polygraph as a test of his trustworthiness. That would be a good start, because the initial results of his clearance process are pretty lousy.
That's what I thought - you're an imbecile and don't know wtf you're talking about. Go ahead and Google that like you do all your expert opinions.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by cwtcr hokie »

ip_law-hokie wrote:Not looking good my neck friends.

Donald Trump claims 'complete power' to issue pardons amid reports he wants to pardon himself over Russia investigations - Evening Standard
https://apple.news/AZ4ejjioaTV-ENZ8_fp8BiQ



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Yes, the MSM once again blew up a flippant comment by Trump.. shocking

What would he be pardoning himself or anyone else for, hard to be pardoned for nothing and so far after a year and the constant barrage from the MSM there is still NOTHING.
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Re: Trump talking pardons and Hillary

Post by HokieFanDC »

USN_Hokie wrote:
HokieFanDC wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:
HokieFanDC wrote:
BigDave wrote:
USN_Hokie wrote:And? He has a high level clearance that someone like yourself, being a lover of Trotsky and associating with "Johns", would very likely not be eligible for.

The government thinks he's more trustworthy than you. Maybe something to think about...
I have always assumed (not sure if it is a good assumption or a bad assumption) that a lot of regime officials on both sides could not get a security clearance if they were, say, applying to work as a software developer for a government contractor, but can only get one because the regime wants them to.
Clearly, with Kushner, his position has allowed him to retain his clearance. How many "oops" do you get with regard to your disclosures, before it's clear you can't be trusted?
Clearly? Please explain your rationale and bonafides.
LOL. Lying on the clearance form should be reason enough not to get clearance. He submitted a BS form to start with. Then after months of revising it, he still "left out" meetings. How many chances do you think he should get?
Maybe he should take a polygraph as a test of his trustworthiness. That would be a good start, because the initial results of his clearance process are pretty lousy.
That's what I thought - you're an imbecile and don't know wtf you're talking about. Go ahead and Google that like you do all your expert opinions.
I didn't say mine was an expert opinion. But I can read, and lots of experts have the opinion that the issues with his form are meaningful. But, hey, feel free to enlighten me, genius. We're all very interested in your bonafide opinion.

Here are some general thoughts.

First, one of the main goals of the clearance process is to determine a person's trustworthiness and character. Kushner's omissions and revisions certainly bring into question his character. Are you going to argue that they don't?

And issues with the SF-86 are the second biggest reason people are denied clearance.
With Kushner, we don't really know the opinion on his "missteps". It doesn't appear he has been given actual clearance yet, and we don't know if they've even OK'd the issues with his forms.

We also don't know anything about the FBI investigation into the info provided on the form.

You can give an opinion, but it's just speculation. But, I'd like to know why you think that Kushner's omissions and changes are no big deal.
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