Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
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Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
If you bend over backwards long enough,
eventually you'll fall down.
eventually you'll fall down.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
Don't forget children and blacks. Obama closed the zoo and Smithsonians too, making children cry. He put the Martin Luther King Memorial in chains, free at last no more... to anger blacks. Obama is a pretty and small person.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
I never said I was OK with it. I said your characterization of it was not based on any evidence, other than your typical bias and fantasy scenarios.
It's simple. Tell me that no other protests have occurred on the National Mall. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
Tell me that other groups have asked to hold rallies or protests, and were denied. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
All the other stuff you're listing is horrible, disgusting, and the blame lies fully on....Obama, the House, and the Senate. All those things you listed are exactly what the House knew would happen when they decided to use the shutdown as their negotiating tool. Why did they use it as their leverage? Because using it would embarrass vets, hurt small businesses, abuse families of fallen soldiers, and on and on and on. They did it b/c it would be painful. And now, they are trying to look like heroes by trying to undo the ones that their constituents care about the most.
You're just playing into their political game, hook, line, and sinker.
Should the Senate approve the piecemeal funding. 100% yes, because it's the right thing to do. Shutting down the govt was the wrong thing to do, and they should take the opportunity to minimize the impact of the House stupidity. Unfortunately, they are just as stupid, uncaring, and choose politics before country, as the House.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
Sorry, but you're wrong IMO. The Rs didn't expect Obama to go to extremes and be vindictive and partisan in shutting down certain public spaces that required no action. That is solely on him.HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
I never said I was OK with it. I said your characterization of it was not based on any evidence, other than your typical bias and fantasy scenarios.
It's simple. Tell me that no other protests have occurred on the National Mall. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
Tell me that other groups have asked to hold rallies or protests, and were denied. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
All the other stuff you're listing is horrible, disgusting, and the blame lies fully on....Obama, the House, and the Senate. All those things you listed are exactly what the House knew would happen when they decided to use the shutdown as their negotiating tool. Why did they use it as their leverage? Because using it would embarrass vets, hurt small businesses, abuse families of fallen soldiers, and on and on and on. They did it b/c it would be painful. And now, they are trying to look like heroes by trying to undo the ones that their constituents care about the most.
You're just playing into their political game, hook, line, and sinker.
Should the Senate approve the piecemeal funding. 100% yes, because it's the right thing to do. Shutting down the govt was the wrong thing to do, and they should take the opportunity to minimize the impact of the House stupidity. Unfortunately, they are just as stupid, uncaring, and choose politics before country, as the House.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
That's just false. This is the first shutdown where Park Services have gone to such lengths, like closing open air plazas. That's all on Obama the Tyrannical.HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
I never said I was OK with it. I said your characterization of it was not based on any evidence, other than your typical bias and fantasy scenarios.
It's simple. Tell me that no other protests have occurred on the National Mall. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
Tell me that other groups have asked to hold rallies or protests, and were denied. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
All the other stuff you're listing is horrible, disgusting, and the blame lies fully on....Obama, the House, and the Senate. All those things you listed are exactly what the House knew would happen when they decided to use the shutdown as their negotiating tool. Why did they use it as their leverage? Because using it would embarrass vets, hurt small businesses, abuse families of fallen soldiers, and on and on and on. They did it b/c it would be painful. And now, they are trying to look like heroes by trying to undo the ones that their constituents care about the most.
You're just playing into their political game, hook, line, and sinker.
Should the Senate approve the piecemeal funding. 100% yes, because it's the right thing to do. Shutting down the govt was the wrong thing to do, and they should take the opportunity to minimize the impact of the House stupidity. Unfortunately, they are just as stupid, uncaring, and choose politics before country, as the House.
Unvaccinated,. mask free, and still alive.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
You're wrong. Never have open air monuments been barricaded off b/c of a gov shut down. Never have people living in private homes near/on national parks have been driven from their homes. Never have dead soldiers families been denied funerals. All of these publicity stunts on solely on Obama. But keep defending him and blaming Republicans if that's your schtick.
HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
I never said I was OK with it. I said your characterization of it was not based on any evidence, other than your typical bias and fantasy scenarios.
It's simple. Tell me that no other protests have occurred on the National Mall. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
Tell me that other groups have asked to hold rallies or protests, and were denied. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
All the other stuff you're listing is horrible, disgusting, and the blame lies fully on....Obama, the House, and the Senate. All those things you listed are exactly what the House knew would happen when they decided to use the shutdown as their negotiating tool. Why did they use it as their leverage? Because using it would embarrass vets, hurt small businesses, abuse families of fallen soldiers, and on and on and on. They did it b/c it would be painful. And now, they are trying to look like heroes by trying to undo the ones that their constituents care about the most.
You're just playing into their political game, hook, line, and sinker.
Should the Senate approve the piecemeal funding. 100% yes, because it's the right thing to do. Shutting down the govt was the wrong thing to do, and they should take the opportunity to minimize the impact of the House stupidity. Unfortunately, they are just as stupid, uncaring, and choose politics before country, as the House.
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.” ― Voltaire (1694 – 1778)
Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
I just don't get it. How small and petty can someone of such high ranking be? Only a dictator. Close the VIEW of Mt Rushmore? How is that even possible?
133743Hokie wrote:HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
We lived through Obama, you'll live through Trump
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
http://www.argusleader.com/article/2013 ... uth-Dakota
Of course when our warrior king is added to mt Rushmore, blocking the view would be blasphemous, racist.
Of course when our warrior king is added to mt Rushmore, blocking the view would be blasphemous, racist.
RWNJ wrote:I just don't get it. How small and petty can someone of such high ranking be? Only a dictator. Close the VIEW of Mt Rushmore? How is that even possible?
133743Hokie wrote:HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
If you bend over backwards long enough,
eventually you'll fall down.
eventually you'll fall down.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
They deployed the queen's large bottom to obstruct the view</Oakton>RWNJ wrote:I just don't get it. How small and petty can someone of such high ranking be? Only a dictator. Close the VIEW of Mt Rushmore? How is that even possible?
133743Hokie wrote:HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
Unvaccinated,. mask free, and still alive.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
Good one. Wish I'd thought of it.
awesome guy wrote:They deployed the queen's large bottom to obstruct the view</Oakton>RWNJ wrote:I just don't get it. How small and petty can someone of such high ranking be? Only a dictator. Close the VIEW of Mt Rushmore? How is that even possible?
133743Hokie wrote:HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
If you bend over backwards long enough,
eventually you'll fall down.
eventually you'll fall down.
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On December 22, 23 & 24, 1995...
My wife, son and I spent 3 glorious days at the Bright Angel Lodge Grand Canyon National Park South Rim. We had a great time.
President Bill Clinton didn't shut down the park.
President Bill Clinton didn't shut down the park.
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
I am not defending Obama. Just b/c you keep saying it, doesn't make it true.UpstateSCHokie wrote:You're wrong. Never have open air monuments been barricaded off b/c of a gov shut down. Never have people living in private homes near/on national parks have been driven from their homes. Never have dead soldiers families been denied funerals. All of these publicity stunts on solely on Obama. But keep defending him and blaming Republicans if that's your schtick.
HokieFanDC wrote:oaktonhokie wrote:mall?
Close the wwii memorial.
Close businesses in Virginia and the grand canyon and around the country that depend on tourism to make a living. You know, small businesses.
Close the VIEW to mt rushmore.
Make it hurt.
Pay lots of money to guard things. Pay money to keep people out. When it costs nothing (or at least less) to keep it open.
But, we have non americans with a leftist agenda, supported by Obama and the Marxists to get Hispanic votes who really need to be on the otherwise CLOSED mall.
Priorities are to embarrass vets, hurt small businesses and abuse the families of fallen soldiers. But let the illegals march.
So um dc, comments...?
I never said I was OK with it. I said your characterization of it was not based on any evidence, other than your typical bias and fantasy scenarios.
It's simple. Tell me that no other protests have occurred on the National Mall. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
Tell me that other groups have asked to hold rallies or protests, and were denied. That would back up your claim, and be despicable.
All the other stuff you're listing is horrible, disgusting, and the blame lies fully on....Obama, the House, and the Senate. All those things you listed are exactly what the House knew would happen when they decided to use the shutdown as their negotiating tool. Why did they use it as their leverage? Because using it would embarrass vets, hurt small businesses, abuse families of fallen soldiers, and on and on and on. They did it b/c it would be painful. And now, they are trying to look like heroes by trying to undo the ones that their constituents care about the most.
You're just playing into their political game, hook, line, and sinker.
Should the Senate approve the piecemeal funding. 100% yes, because it's the right thing to do. Shutting down the govt was the wrong thing to do, and they should take the opportunity to minimize the impact of the House stupidity. Unfortunately, they are just as stupid, uncaring, and choose politics before country, as the House.
You're right, I don't think those specific things have been done before, and they are 100% petty, vindictive and childish.
But, you're focusing on a very few instances of things that you can pin on Obama and ignoring all the other things that aren't being done b/c of the shutdown...all things that are known results of going down the route of forcing a shutdown. Those are bad things, and the House knew that there would be bad things happening when they took the route they took.
Do you deny that? Do you deny that the House knew there would be very bad consequences from the shutdown? That Obama is turning the screws to make it even worse, just shows what an aHole he is. But, that doesn't excuse the House actions that would have bad outcomes, even if Obama did nothing.
So, stop calling it "my schtick", b/c that's not what I'm doing at all. In fact, you're the ones with the schtick of defending the Pubs and only blaming Obama, or the Senate.
Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
Haven't both the House and the president gone down the route of forcing a shutdown? Didn't the president know the same things the House knew? We have a government shutdown/lockdown because of an impasse between the president and the House, with both sides willing to accept it rather than abandon their position. How this can be blamed on one side more than the other is a mystery to me.HokieFanDC wrote:But, you're focusing on a very few instances of things that you can pin on Obama and ignoring all the other things that aren't being done b/c of the shutdown...all things that are known results of going down the route of forcing a shutdown. Those are bad things, and the House knew that there would be bad things happening when they took the route they took.
Do you deny that? Do you deny that the House knew there would be very bad consequences from the shutdown?
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
Not sure if this is in response to just me, but I've been pretty consistent that blame lies on both sides.
If you ask me if the House has more blame in this, I'll say yes, but that doesn't hold the POTUS or the Senate blameless.
The reason I hold the House more accountable is b/c the action they're trying to force is a stoppage of the ACA. It's something they've been trying, and failing, to do, for a couple years now.
The POTUS opened up a crapstorm when he delayed the employer mandate, which was stupid. But, if the House thinks (and they've said so many times) that it is Unconstitutional, then challenge it. They won't do that, because it's not politically expedient.
There are processes in place to do what they want to do, if they have the political power to do so. They have failed in their attempts to use those processes many, many times. Just b/c you can't get your way using the legislative process, doesn't mean you should do something outside of that. Or, if you are going to something outside the normal course, embrace it, don't deflect the results.
And I'll say it again, before someone else claims I'm defending Obama. The choice the House made doesn't absolve Obama of any of the extreme measures he's taking to make it even worse. But, to just talk about those is ignoring the other side.
If you ask me if the House has more blame in this, I'll say yes, but that doesn't hold the POTUS or the Senate blameless.
The reason I hold the House more accountable is b/c the action they're trying to force is a stoppage of the ACA. It's something they've been trying, and failing, to do, for a couple years now.
The POTUS opened up a crapstorm when he delayed the employer mandate, which was stupid. But, if the House thinks (and they've said so many times) that it is Unconstitutional, then challenge it. They won't do that, because it's not politically expedient.
There are processes in place to do what they want to do, if they have the political power to do so. They have failed in their attempts to use those processes many, many times. Just b/c you can't get your way using the legislative process, doesn't mean you should do something outside of that. Or, if you are going to something outside the normal course, embrace it, don't deflect the results.
And I'll say it again, before someone else claims I'm defending Obama. The choice the House made doesn't absolve Obama of any of the extreme measures he's taking to make it even worse. But, to just talk about those is ignoring the other side.
GCHokie78 wrote:Haven't both the House and the president gone down the route of forcing a shutdown? Didn't the president know the same things the House knew? We have a government shutdown/lockdown because of an impasse between the president and the House, with both sides willing to accept it rather than abandon their position. How this can be blamed on one side more than the other is a mystery to me.HokieFanDC wrote:But, you're focusing on a very few instances of things that you can pin on Obama and ignoring all the other things that aren't being done b/c of the shutdown...all things that are known results of going down the route of forcing a shutdown. Those are bad things, and the House knew that there would be bad things happening when they took the route they took.
Do you deny that? Do you deny that the House knew there would be very bad consequences from the shutdown?
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
Surely you see it's Reid and Obama they face "following the process", right. Shutdowns are part of the process too and works better than sending paper to Reid to bury in committee.HokieFanDC wrote:Not sure if this is in response to just me, but I've been pretty consistent that blame lies on both sides.
If you ask me if the House has more blame in this, I'll say yes, but that doesn't hold the POTUS or the Senate blameless.
The reason I hold the House more accountable is b/c the action they're trying to force is a stoppage of the ACA. It's something they've been trying, and failing, to do, for a couple years now.
The POTUS opened up a crapstorm when he delayed the employer mandate, which was stupid. But, if the House thinks (and they've said so many times) that it is Unconstitutional, then challenge it. They won't do that, because it's not politically expedient.
There are processes in place to do what they want to do, if they have the political power to do so. They have failed in their attempts to use those processes many, many times. Just b/c you can't get your way using the legislative process, doesn't mean you should do something outside of that. Or, if you are going to something outside the normal course, embrace it, don't deflect the results.
And I'll say it again, before someone else claims I'm defending Obama. The choice the House made doesn't absolve Obama of any of the extreme measures he's taking to make it even worse. But, to just talk about those is ignoring the other side.
GCHokie78 wrote:Haven't both the House and the president gone down the route of forcing a shutdown? Didn't the president know the same things the House knew? We have a government shutdown/lockdown because of an impasse between the president and the House, with both sides willing to accept it rather than abandon their position. How this can be blamed on one side more than the other is a mystery to me.HokieFanDC wrote:But, you're focusing on a very few instances of things that you can pin on Obama and ignoring all the other things that aren't being done b/c of the shutdown...all things that are known results of going down the route of forcing a shutdown. Those are bad things, and the House knew that there would be bad things happening when they took the route they took.
Do you deny that? Do you deny that the House knew there would be very bad consequences from the shutdown?
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
Of course that's who they face. And they've been losing that battle miserably, because they don't have the power to force anything else. They don't have that power. So, they take extreme measures like the shutdown. I'm agreeing it's within their power, and is part of the process, but it's an extreme measure within that process. I'm not saying they can't do it, but when it gets to that point, they should stop blaming people b/c they have failed to get it done through the voting process. They made the decision to not vote on the clean CR. They did that b/c they knew (or were pretty sure) it would pass. That was the normal legislative process. By failing to do that, they have gone outside of the process. Yes, the Senate has done that too, but that doesn't absolve the GOP. You're not going to get me, or most normal people, to hold them blameless.awesome guy wrote:Surely you see it's Reid and Obama they face "following the process", right. Shutdowns are part of the process too and works better than sending paper to Reid to bury in committee.HokieFanDC wrote:Not sure if this is in response to just me, but I've been pretty consistent that blame lies on both sides.
If you ask me if the House has more blame in this, I'll say yes, but that doesn't hold the POTUS or the Senate blameless.
The reason I hold the House more accountable is b/c the action they're trying to force is a stoppage of the ACA. It's something they've been trying, and failing, to do, for a couple years now.
The POTUS opened up a crapstorm when he delayed the employer mandate, which was stupid. But, if the House thinks (and they've said so many times) that it is Unconstitutional, then challenge it. They won't do that, because it's not politically expedient.
There are processes in place to do what they want to do, if they have the political power to do so. They have failed in their attempts to use those processes many, many times. Just b/c you can't get your way using the legislative process, doesn't mean you should do something outside of that. Or, if you are going to something outside the normal course, embrace it, don't deflect the results.
And I'll say it again, before someone else claims I'm defending Obama. The choice the House made doesn't absolve Obama of any of the extreme measures he's taking to make it even worse. But, to just talk about those is ignoring the other side.
GCHokie78 wrote:Haven't both the House and the president gone down the route of forcing a shutdown? Didn't the president know the same things the House knew? We have a government shutdown/lockdown because of an impasse between the president and the House, with both sides willing to accept it rather than abandon their position. How this can be blamed on one side more than the other is a mystery to me.HokieFanDC wrote:But, you're focusing on a very few instances of things that you can pin on Obama and ignoring all the other things that aren't being done b/c of the shutdown...all things that are known results of going down the route of forcing a shutdown. Those are bad things, and the House knew that there would be bad things happening when they took the route they took.
Do you deny that? Do you deny that the House knew there would be very bad consequences from the shutdown?
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
The voting process is how the came to power. They were elected to overturn Obamacare and curb spending. So the process is working to prevent a minority of people from forcing their will on the majority. Talking about the majority that's against Obamacare of course.HokieFanDC wrote:Of course that's who they face. And they've been losing that battle miserably, because they don't have the power to force anything else. They don't have that power. So, they take extreme measures like the shutdown. I'm agreeing it's within their power, and is part of the process, but it's an extreme measure within that process. I'm not saying they can't do it, but when it gets to that point, they should stop blaming people b/c they have failed to get it done through the voting process. They made the decision to not vote on the clean CR. They did that b/c they knew (or were pretty sure) it would pass. That was the normal legislative process. By failing to do that, they have gone outside of the process. Yes, the Senate has done that too, but that doesn't absolve the GOP. You're not going to get me, or most normal people, to hold them blameless.awesome guy wrote:Surely you see it's Reid and Obama they face "following the process", right. Shutdowns are part of the process too and works better than sending paper to Reid to bury in committee.HokieFanDC wrote:Not sure if this is in response to just me, but I've been pretty consistent that blame lies on both sides.
If you ask me if the House has more blame in this, I'll say yes, but that doesn't hold the POTUS or the Senate blameless.
The reason I hold the House more accountable is b/c the action they're trying to force is a stoppage of the ACA. It's something they've been trying, and failing, to do, for a couple years now.
The POTUS opened up a crapstorm when he delayed the employer mandate, which was stupid. But, if the House thinks (and they've said so many times) that it is Unconstitutional, then challenge it. They won't do that, because it's not politically expedient.
There are processes in place to do what they want to do, if they have the political power to do so. They have failed in their attempts to use those processes many, many times. Just b/c you can't get your way using the legislative process, doesn't mean you should do something outside of that. Or, if you are going to something outside the normal course, embrace it, don't deflect the results.
And I'll say it again, before someone else claims I'm defending Obama. The choice the House made doesn't absolve Obama of any of the extreme measures he's taking to make it even worse. But, to just talk about those is ignoring the other side.
GCHokie78 wrote:Haven't both the House and the president gone down the route of forcing a shutdown? Didn't the president know the same things the House knew? We have a government shutdown/lockdown because of an impasse between the president and the House, with both sides willing to accept it rather than abandon their position. How this can be blamed on one side more than the other is a mystery to me.HokieFanDC wrote:But, you're focusing on a very few instances of things that you can pin on Obama and ignoring all the other things that aren't being done b/c of the shutdown...all things that are known results of going down the route of forcing a shutdown. Those are bad things, and the House knew that there would be bad things happening when they took the route they took.
Do you deny that? Do you deny that the House knew there would be very bad consequences from the shutdown?
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Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
They were elected by their constituents do that. Other Senators and House members were elected to do other things. If the House members who were elected to overturn OCare and cut spending had the power of the majority, they would vote on the CR, and it would fail. But, b/c THEY are the minority, they are trying to force their will on the majority.awesome guy wrote:The voting process is how the came to power. They were elected to overturn Obamacare and curb spending. So the process is working to prevent a minority of people from forcing their will on the majority. Talking about the majority that's against Obamacare of course.HokieFanDC wrote:Of course that's who they face. And they've been losing that battle miserably, because they don't have the power to force anything else. They don't have that power. So, they take extreme measures like the shutdown. I'm agreeing it's within their power, and is part of the process, but it's an extreme measure within that process. I'm not saying they can't do it, but when it gets to that point, they should stop blaming people b/c they have failed to get it done through the voting process. They made the decision to not vote on the clean CR. They did that b/c they knew (or were pretty sure) it would pass. That was the normal legislative process. By failing to do that, they have gone outside of the process. Yes, the Senate has done that too, but that doesn't absolve the GOP. You're not going to get me, or most normal people, to hold them blameless.awesome guy wrote:Surely you see it's Reid and Obama they face "following the process", right. Shutdowns are part of the process too and works better than sending paper to Reid to bury in committee.GCHokie78 wrote:Haven't both the House and the president gone down the route of forcing a shutdown? Didn't the president know the same things the House knew? We have a government shutdown/lockdown because of an impasse between the president and the House, with both sides willing to accept it rather than abandon their position. How this can be blamed on one side more than the other is a mystery to me.HokieFanDC wrote:But, you're focusing on a very few instances of things that you can pin on Obama and ignoring all the other things that aren't being done b/c of the shutdown...all things that are known results of going down the route of forcing a shutdown. Those are bad things, and the House knew that there would be bad things happening when they took the route they took.
Do you deny that? Do you deny that the House knew there would be very bad consequences from the shutdown?
Lots of people don't like Ocare. Very few people think shutting down the govt is the way we should be working to change it, or get rid of it.
Re: Hey dc, you still ok with the illegals protesting on the
I think it's much more simple than that. The president wants a debt limit increase with no stipulations. The House wants stipulations. Both are willing to shut down the government to get what they want. That makes both sides equally responsible for the shutdown.HokieFanDC wrote:The reason I hold the House more accountable is b/c the action they're trying to force is a stoppage of the ACA. It's something they've been trying, and failing, to do, for a couple years now.
The POTUS opened up a crapstorm when he delayed the employer mandate, which was stupid. But, if the House thinks (and they've said so many times) that it is Unconstitutional, then challenge it. They won't do that, because it's not politically expedient.
There are processes in place to do what they want to do, if they have the political power to do so. They have failed in their attempts to use those processes many, many times. Just b/c you can't get your way using the legislative process, doesn't mean you should do something outside of that. Or, if you are going to something outside the normal course, embrace it, don't deflect the results.
And I'll say it again, before someone else claims I'm defending Obama. The choice the House made doesn't absolve Obama of any of the extreme measures he's taking to make it even worse. But, to just talk about those is ignoring the other side.
One side has offered solutions that would end the shutdown, including one that would delay the individual mandate but not defund Obamacare. The other side refuses to even talk about it, insisting on a clean debt limit before they'll talk about it. Offering to negotiate only after getting everything you want isn't much of an offer.
So in my view, both sides are equally responsible for starting the shutdown, but the president is more to blame for prolonging it.